In this special crossover episode, Peter Shane was a guest on Broken Law, a podcast from the American Constitution Society. The ACS has agreed to let us publish the podcast here for our listeners. ___

In these first months of his second term, President Trump has fired or attempted to fire thousands upon thousands of federal workers. Notable among those affected by this unprecedented flexing of executive authority are leaders of independent agencies. Peter Shane joins Lindsay Langholz to discuss two recent cases that have significant implications on our system of checks and balances and just how far the president is allowed to go when it comes to control over independent agencies.

Host: Lindsay Langholz, Senior Director of Policy and Program, ACS

Guest: Peter Shane, Distinguished Scholar in Residence and Adjunct Professor of Law, New York University School of Law; Jacob E. Davis and Jacob E. Davis II Chair in Law Emeritus at The Ohio State University Moritz College of Law.

Link: Litigation Tracker: Legal Challenges to Trump Administration Actions, Just Security

Link: Lawfare

Link: Does Evidence Matter? Originalism and the Separation of Powers, by Cass Sunstein

Link: The Supreme Court's Fed Carveout: An Initial Assessment, by Lev Menand

Email the Show: Podcast@ACSLaw.org

Mary McCord, executive director of the Institute for Constitutional Advocacy and Protection(ICAP) and Visiting Professor of Law at theGeorgetown University Law Center, discusses with Peter Project 2025’s dangerous vision of a deeply politicized Justice Department acting in lockstep with a president bent on punishing his adversaries. She also explains why such a president is now likely freed of criminal liability for corruption in supervising the Justice Department (or the IRS or the CIA or . . .), given the Supreme Court’s presidential immunity decision in Trump v. United States.

Brendan Duke, senior director for economic policy at American Progress, explains to Peter the likely burdens on middle-income and lower-income families if Congress were to enact the near-term and longer-term/fundamental tax reform programs recommended by Project 2025. (As a bonus, he even explains tariffs!)